On Saturday January 20, 2007 a historic debate billed as "A Clash of Civilizations or World Civilization?" took place in London, witnessed by an audience estimated to be 5,000 in number.

On one side stood Dr. Daniel Pipes and Douglas Murray, representing the view that civilization is the negation of barbarism i.e., radical Islam, or Islamism, and that such a threat must be defeated ideologically and militarily.

On the other side were London Mayor "Red" Ken Livingstone and Salma Yaqoob, a Muslim councilor from Birmingham, representing the Leftist/Islamist alliance. They argued that the West, not radical Islamism is responsible for the world's problems, and that multiculturalism, not victory, is the key to achieving global stability.

Dr. Pipes, a historian and Middle East scholar, began by rejecting the premise of a "clash of civilizations," explaining that the issue is not a clash of civilizations but "a clash of civilization and barbarism."

Expanding on that idea, he went on to say that "world civilization can exist [if one means] something worthy, decent or humane; the opposite of barbarism." to bolster this point, that a wide consensus exists regarding the basic concept of civilization, Dr. Pipes presented passages from the Bible and Qur'an, along with French, British, and American maxims.

He cited the historical threats to the world which emanated from Fascism and Marxism-Leninism, placing in this context the present threat of radical Islam, which he defined as a radical utopian interpretation of Islam that seeks to impose Islamic law universally, further explaining that its goal is to attract talented individuals, take over states, dominate domestic life, aggress against neighbors, and eventually engage in a cosmic confrontation with the West.

Describing himself as a classical liberal and the mayor as "a man of the left" he pointed out that despite their ideological differences, that neither of them "personally would want to be subjected to the Shari'a." Building on this agreed undesirability of living under the strictures of Islamic law, he noted that the two of them disagree on the means to avoid this fate, stating that while Livingstone "looks to multiculturalism...I look to winning the war. He wants everyone to get along. I want to defeat a terrible enemy."

Dr. Pipes challenged the mayor's multicultural impulse of "the right to pursue different cultural values subject only to the restriction that they should not interfere with the similar rights for others," arguing that Livingstone's multicultural approach was fatally flawed. He noted that the mayor - who boasted that tolerance had been a major factor in attracting new residents to London - presided over a city that served as "a safe haven for world-wide terrorism," turning Britain into a significant base for terrorism.

He pointed out that British based terrorists have carried out operations in at least 15 countries: Pakistan, Afghanistan, Kenya, Tanzania, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, Iraq, Jordan, Israel, Algeria, Morocco, Russia, France, Spain, and the United States.

In Pipes' view, the way to combat this problem is to facilitate the "emergence of a an Islam that is modern, moderate, democratic, humane, liberal, and good neighborly, one that is respectful of women, homosexuals, atheists [and] one that grants non-Muslims equal rights with Muslims."

In closing, Dr. Pipes stated that "Muslims, non-Muslims and people on the right and left would agree on the importance of working together to attain such an Islam," adding that "to the extent that we all work together against the barbarism of radical Islam, a world civilization does indeed exist, one that transcends skin-color, geography, politics, and religion."

He expressed the hope that the mayor "can agree here and now to cooperate on such a program." However, the mayor never addressed this offer in the course of the subsequent discussion.

Source: PipeLineNews.org